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	<title>Comments on: Re: foie gras and abortion</title>
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	<link>http://punctum-saliens.org/2008/07/19/re-foie-gras-and-abortion/</link>
	<description>Leaping Point: Take a flying leap and see where you land</description>
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		<title>By: Recent Links Tagged With "foiegras" - JabberTags</title>
		<link>http://punctum-saliens.org/2008/07/19/re-foie-gras-and-abortion/comment-page-1/#comment-3384</link>
		<dc:creator>Recent Links Tagged With "foiegras" - JabberTags</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 10:05:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punctum-saliens.org/?p=265#comment-3384</guid>
		<description>[...]   Foie Gras No Longer 86′d From Chicago Kitchens Saved by joshuahayes on Tue 18-11-2008   Re: foie gras and abortion Saved by pepprmintproductions on Tue 18-11-2008   The Equation for Foie Gras Saved by yellowducky [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...]   Foie Gras No Longer 86′d From Chicago Kitchens Saved by joshuahayes on Tue 18-11-2008   Re: foie gras and abortion Saved by pepprmintproductions on Tue 18-11-2008   The Equation for Foie Gras Saved by yellowducky [...]</p>
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		<title>By: rea</title>
		<link>http://punctum-saliens.org/2008/07/19/re-foie-gras-and-abortion/comment-page-1/#comment-2838</link>
		<dc:creator>rea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Aug 2008 00:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punctum-saliens.org/?p=265#comment-2838</guid>
		<description>wow - i really what i read. i bumped into your blog by chance (while looking for a picture of a stone , white with black dots...)
Good job!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>wow &#8211; i really what i read. i bumped into your blog by chance (while looking for a picture of a stone , white with black dots&#8230;)<br />
Good job!</p>
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		<title>By: Ken</title>
		<link>http://punctum-saliens.org/2008/07/19/re-foie-gras-and-abortion/comment-page-1/#comment-2831</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Jul 2008 01:18:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punctum-saliens.org/?p=265#comment-2831</guid>
		<description>Alan, I don&#039;t think anyone is really PRO-abortion. No one is going to campaign for every woman getting an abortion which is what PRO-abortion would mean. Pro-choice, I think, really is an apt term because it&#039;s all about being able to choose to have an abortion or to choose not to have an abortion.

And I think that PRO-life is an apt term as well &lt;strong&gt;except&lt;/strong&gt; that most, high profile, in-the-news pro-lifers exclusively deal with abortion. They only seem to care about the life of the fetus and once that child is born, the pro-lifer no longer seems to care. They &lt;strong&gt;don&#039;t&lt;/strong&gt; argue for adoption or campaign to make adoption easier or (God forbid) adopt the baby themselves! They want the mother to have the baby and raise the baby by herself (but the single Mom must &quot;get a job&quot; and get off welfare) without the pro-lifer&#039;s help.

And that&#039;s where I take issue. Pro-lifers can call themselves anything they want, I don&#039;t care. It&#039;s what they protest and what they ignore that matters.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alan, I don&#8217;t think anyone is really PRO-abortion. No one is going to campaign for every woman getting an abortion which is what PRO-abortion would mean. Pro-choice, I think, really is an apt term because it&#8217;s all about being able to choose to have an abortion or to choose not to have an abortion.</p>
<p>And I think that PRO-life is an apt term as well <strong>except</strong> that most, high profile, in-the-news pro-lifers exclusively deal with abortion. They only seem to care about the life of the fetus and once that child is born, the pro-lifer no longer seems to care. They <strong>don&#8217;t</strong> argue for adoption or campaign to make adoption easier or (God forbid) adopt the baby themselves! They want the mother to have the baby and raise the baby by herself (but the single Mom must &#8220;get a job&#8221; and get off welfare) without the pro-lifer&#8217;s help.</p>
<p>And that&#8217;s where I take issue. Pro-lifers can call themselves anything they want, I don&#8217;t care. It&#8217;s what they protest and what they ignore that matters.</p>
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		<title>By: Alan</title>
		<link>http://punctum-saliens.org/2008/07/19/re-foie-gras-and-abortion/comment-page-1/#comment-2829</link>
		<dc:creator>Alan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 14:35:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punctum-saliens.org/?p=265#comment-2829</guid>
		<description>The same thing happens in many activist communities... The general public does not really care as much as the activist, so the activist picks an &quot;easy case&quot; with which to make an appeal, gain some points and maybe (very maybe) further the cause. A lot of time the activists pick on a more defenseless population of offenders, because their powerlessness makes for a victory, while going after a more powerful and entrenched foe would result in defeat.

However, my perception of the pro-life / pro-choice activists is that this is not exactly the case. Pro-abortionists and Anti-abortionists have a PR problem in that &quot;abortion&quot;, whatever your stance, is not a pleasant, feel-good, save the world topic. (Typical reaction: Yuck, I think I&#039;ll change the channel.) 

This is especially true for the PRO abortionists, so (if I remember correctly) they made the first move - not PRO abortion, but PRO CHOICE. &quot;Choice&quot; IS a pleasant, feel-good concept.

The anti-abortionists countered (again, if I remember right) with PRO LIFE. Once again, &quot;Life&quot; is a pleasant, feel-good, save-the-world concept.

Neither was primarily or principly pro CHOICE or LIFE. They were, and are, fighting about abortion. But by using euphemisms for their stance they dragged in all sorts of peripheral issues (especially the pro-lifers) that they were, and are, unprepared to deal with very well.

But having done so, I think it is fair to challenge them on it, and to ask for a broader, more socially responsible response to abortion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The same thing happens in many activist communities&#8230; The general public does not really care as much as the activist, so the activist picks an &#8220;easy case&#8221; with which to make an appeal, gain some points and maybe (very maybe) further the cause. A lot of time the activists pick on a more defenseless population of offenders, because their powerlessness makes for a victory, while going after a more powerful and entrenched foe would result in defeat.</p>
<p>However, my perception of the pro-life / pro-choice activists is that this is not exactly the case. Pro-abortionists and Anti-abortionists have a PR problem in that &#8220;abortion&#8221;, whatever your stance, is not a pleasant, feel-good, save the world topic. (Typical reaction: Yuck, I think I&#8217;ll change the channel.) </p>
<p>This is especially true for the PRO abortionists, so (if I remember correctly) they made the first move &#8211; not PRO abortion, but PRO CHOICE. &#8220;Choice&#8221; IS a pleasant, feel-good concept.</p>
<p>The anti-abortionists countered (again, if I remember right) with PRO LIFE. Once again, &#8220;Life&#8221; is a pleasant, feel-good, save-the-world concept.</p>
<p>Neither was primarily or principly pro CHOICE or LIFE. They were, and are, fighting about abortion. But by using euphemisms for their stance they dragged in all sorts of peripheral issues (especially the pro-lifers) that they were, and are, unprepared to deal with very well.</p>
<p>But having done so, I think it is fair to challenge them on it, and to ask for a broader, more socially responsible response to abortion.</p>
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		<title>By: Drew</title>
		<link>http://punctum-saliens.org/2008/07/19/re-foie-gras-and-abortion/comment-page-1/#comment-2827</link>
		<dc:creator>Drew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Jul 2008 00:33:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://punctum-saliens.org/?p=265#comment-2827</guid>
		<description>Glad to know my thoughts land somewhere once in a blue moon!  Of course I concur and think you are spot on with your take here.  I am a strong supporter of any legislation against animal cruelty.  My wife and I have been in the animal rescue business or several years.  BTW, we eat meat too and think PETA takes its cause to an absurd level. Although they have exposed some deplorable practices that probably would not have received much notice otherwise (i.e. the fur trade with cats and dogs in China where they literally treat cages packed with animals like bails of hay.

Cheers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Glad to know my thoughts land somewhere once in a blue moon!  Of course I concur and think you are spot on with your take here.  I am a strong supporter of any legislation against animal cruelty.  My wife and I have been in the animal rescue business or several years.  BTW, we eat meat too and think PETA takes its cause to an absurd level. Although they have exposed some deplorable practices that probably would not have received much notice otherwise (i.e. the fur trade with cats and dogs in China where they literally treat cages packed with animals like bails of hay.</p>
<p>Cheers.</p>
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