You have a well thought out and very interesting point-of-view and make a fairly convincing argument.

Thank you.

I am enjoying reading your blog.

Sincerley,

Peter

If a religion that is not based on the Christian Bible has people living a “good” life and repenting from evil, is that good enough? What if, as with Dionysus, this religion has a god who sacrifices himself for us yet he is not named Jesus Christ, is that good enough?

You seem to say that this is all ok but then back off a bit by saying “but … it is very hard … without hearing the Word.”

One of the points I’m trying to make in these posts is that, within the common Christian viewpoint, the “safety net” that exists for people who are, for whatever reason, unable to hear about Jesus Christ does not work. God being “visible” from creation still relies on getting to the Christian God, specifically, and does not allow for any other religion or god.

Furthermore, I see absolutely no evidence of this actually working for anyone — not even in the Bible. The Bible has no examples of anyone coming to God or Jesus without hearing about God or Jesus from someone. That is why I claim this is merely a rationalization to make Christians feel better; to allow them to put blame on the “heathen” for actively rejecting God.

The other “safety net” — that if you are sincere enough in your quest for (the Christian) God then God will send someone to preach to you — is occasionally employed in the Bible but somehow didn’t work for Buddha or Mohammed, among others. And to say that these two men were not sincere enough is, in my opinion, to say that no one could ever be sincere enough. Hence, this, too, seems to be another rationalization that let’s Christians blame the “heathen” and not God or themselves.

If there are nations who still have not heard, is that God’s fault? We have been commissioned to go into all the world. If we do not answer His call, is that God’s fault or should it be on our heads?

I absolutely agree with the added stipulation that it is also not the fault of the person who has not heard. Christians are to blame for any one who does not hear about Jesus Christ and ends up in Hell because 1) as you said, there is a commission to “go into all the world” and 2) Christians (a sweeping generalization, I know, so exclude yourself if you don’t feel this way) are so against other religions that they don’t allow any other alternative to Christianity. It’s Christianity’s God or nothing and the only way to Christianity’s God is by hearing.

However, is it not the attitude of our hearts which is important?

Many people confess with their mouths that they are ‘Christians’ but don’t really believe it in their hearts. Many want fire insurance but don’t want that whole ‘repentance’ thing.

I don’t see that God has to relax His standards at all to to say to someone ‘You heard creation calling out my name and you recognized the sound. You saw creation and recognized the creator. You felt your conscience convicting you of right and wrong and resolved to live by what is right, even if you screwed up sometimes - and I will honor that.’

The law shows us our sin. Our repentance brings us to Christ. We don’t have to know His name (or any of His names) to recognize our sin and to be repentant.

I am no theologian and no scholar and I also know I am not God and that He looks at and judges our hearts, which I can’t do.

We know that the heavens declare the glory of God. Many people see that but reject Him out of the evil in their hearts. Others see it and choose to accept Him yet are still unwilling to turn from their wicked ways. Others still see, believe and turn. We have the gospel, the good news and it is our responsibility to take that good news to all nations, to lay out the need for salvation and help them recognize and turn from their sins.

I believe that God is loving enough to accept those who have repented in their hearts even though they have never heard the name Jesus but that it is very hard in our sinful state for us to do that without hearing the Word.

If there are nations who still have not heard, is that God’s fault? We have been commissioned to go into all the world. If we do not answer His call, is that God’s fault or should it be on our heads?

First of all, I whole heartedly agree that “we try to put God in a box based on our own, human, understanding of justice and love.” In my opinion, many arguments against God brought by atheists are of exactly this form — “I don’t think God should or would or … do this or that.” How do we know wht God woulda shoulda coulda?

In regards to this post and your comments, much of my thinking comes from the teaching that Jesus replaced the old covenant and Paul often talks about not being under the Law any more. Plus, many Christians will emphatically say that Jesus is the only way based on Jesus’ words: “I am the way …”

So, you do offer that “middle way,” so to speak, that so many times is not seen in our black-and-white world. Namely that if you’ve heard of Jesus then you are judged on your acceptance of him; if you haven’t heard of Jesus then you are judge on your keeping your own “moral standard” as Josh McDowell says.

This makes sense and I can get this from the Romans passage but given God’s justness I don’t see it practically working because no one is going to keep their own moral standard or any law derived from nature because everyone sins. So, for this to be a viable solution, God must relax his requirement of being perfect and accept almost. And most Christians, I think, will vehemently oppose this.

Paul, himself, even says that “I do what I don’t want to do and don’t do what I do want to do” so how can anyone “do by nature things required by the law”? It’s against our very nature to obey the law!

God is Just. It is also true that God has the right to condemn entire civilizations to hell but the bible is there to teach us about God’s character and I don’t think that idea totally fits with His character.

There are only two ways presented in the bible to get to heaven - the old covenant and then its replacement, the new covenant.

Is there any suggestion that Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, Noah, Joseph and all the others who died before the Law was given are going to be sent to hell? Not at all.

For those who have never heard of the covenant there is clearly grace providing they recognize God through the beauty of His creation and obey the consciences he gives them.

Romans 2:12-16

All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. For it is not those who hear the law who are righteous in God’s sight, but it is those who obey the law who will be declared righteous. (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) This will take place on the day when God will judge men’s secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

God is good. He is not evil. There are many things about ultimate justice that we simply cannot comprehend because we are not God and i think we try to put God in a box based on our own, human, understanding of justice and love.